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So I've been hearing quite the buzz about this single molecule lately & I wasn't sure if LP was planning on experimenting with it yet, but if you do, I will be on this one; like white on rice. I am very happy that LP offers Topper now & I would gladly shell out for any blend that contains Neno, or the molecule by itself.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Pregnenolone

http://hackingthehive.com/wiki/main/pheromones/molecules/pregnenolone/

Edited by Beccah
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What is the evidence that it is/might be a human pheromone (as opposed to its known function as a hormone). A quick and dirty google scholar search didn't turn up much that would point to that. Have there been any publications cited in your readings about this?

 

I'm more than a little creeped out by the concept of trying to sneak hormones into other people's bodies, though.

Edited by xev
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What is the evidence that it is/might be a human pheromone (as opposed to its known function as a hormone). A quick and dirty google scholar search didn't turn up much that would point to that. Have there been any publications cited in your readings about this?

 

I'm more than a little creeped out by the concept of trying to sneak hormones into other people's bodies, though.

Idk, users have reported good results with it, & honestly most pheromones *are* human hormones/steroids, so if you have qualms along those those lines I suggest foregoing pheromones altogether, imo. (I hope you don't take what I said the wrong way. You are super intelligent & I really respect you & enjoy debating things with you {even though you're smarter than me})

Edited by Beccah
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That molecules pretty fun.My mum likes the bottle of it i got for her from alpha dream.Has quite consistent mood boosting effects.Though how much of a boost depends on the person as with most pheromones(>_<)

Edited by meng123
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Idk, users have reported good results with it, & honestly most pheromones *are* human hormones/steroids, so if you have qualms along those those lines I suggest foregoing pheromones altogether, imo. (I hope you don't take what I said the wrong way. You are super intelligent & I really respect you & enjoy debating things with you {even though you're smarter than me})

 

No, Beccah, pheromones are not hormones. That simply isn't true. There is a very distinct difference between a hormone and a pheromone. (Although it is possible that a molecule could function as both, but I don't know of any in humans).

 

A hormone's adaptive function is to signal within the body of an individual. For example, when you see a grizzly bear, epinephrine is produced that travels throughout your body to make your heart beat more quickly so you can run away from it. That epinephrine produced in your body cannot get to people around you, although it could trigger the production of pheromones, that might affect the people around you. Hormones have no natural way of getting from one individual to another.

 

A pheromone's adaptive function is to signal from one indiividual to another individual of the same species. These have natural ways of getting to from one person to another -- they are volatile and emitted as body odors, and because we have evolved these chemical communication systems, they work under very specific parameters, and have been "proven safe" if you will by millions of years of natural selection, at least under normal conditions and in normal doses or concentrations.

 

"Steroid" is a chemical type. Most animal hormones (but not all), a few plant hormones, and all the human pheromones or putative pheromones I know of are steroids, but this doesn't make hormones and pheromones the same thing. Cholesterol and Ergosterol are steroids but iare not hormones or pheromones. There are other steroids that are not hormones or pheromones.

 

Do we know what a hormone precurser like pregnenolone will do if used in this unnatural way? It is a precursor to progesterones, which in turn control the other sex hormones. The cascade reactions might be very difficult to predict. Its one thing to sniff, take, inject yourself, and something else entirely to do this to other people. Plus there are so many endocrine disruptors polluting the environment anyway, do we need more?

 

The first line of evidence for me, that a compound is pheromone, would be that it is 1) volatile and 2) emitted in body odors of normal healthy adults. That would be what I would want to see before using this molecule.

Edited by xev
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Well, that is why I like debating these issues with people like yourself (super intelligent & educated in the sciences). My question is this; is pregnenolone not produced by pregnant women? I'm just asking, because this is my very limited understanding of it. Again, I highly value your input.

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That was an interesting read Xev! So I am curious, if pregnenolone is a hormone, what other "pheromones" have we been using that are actually hormones? The only other one I can think of that might be is oxytocin, which I tend not to use anyway?

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Oxytocin is the only one that I know about Synergist. In this case, from what I have heard, it is unlikely to be successfully used in a spray form because it is not very volatile, and I have read several sources say that one would have to spray a huge amount up someone's nose to dose them with it. In any case, oxyocin is absolutely NOT a pheromone, and it can have very profound effects (it induces labor in pregnant women for example), so I would not consider it ethical to use it at all under any circumstances.

 

Beccah, pregenolone is produced in pregnant women, and everyone else as well. It is a precursor to the production of numerous other hormones (NOT just the sex hormones) that are needed in a normal healthy adult, as well as being a hormone itself. Hormones control everything in the body, not just sexual attraction. Hormones control your blood sugar, the functioning of your kidneys, the oxygen levels in your blood, etc. every minute of every day. And hormones work in such a way that very tiny amounts of them have profound affects on one's body. Anyone who has ever had a medical problem involving hormones being out of what knows this -- diabetics, hypothyroidism, hyperthyroidism, adrenal issues, etc. Just look at the list of symptoms associated, for example, with hypo- or hyperthyroidism. The list goes on and on. Most hormones have not one but many complex functions. They affect other hormones, which in turn affect other hormones. It is mind boggling and complicated. They are not something to mess around with outside a doctor's care.

 

It is all pretty scary. I personally will never buy another phero product that doesn't list all the ingredients as clearly being pheromones.

 

And yep, I have a pile of products right now with "secret" ingredients, including some I recently got in a trade because I hadn't really thought this whole thing through carefully. I have only recently come to realize that when other companies talk of secret molecules, they are probably researching hormones. It is unethical in my book and I will never do business with them again, or purchase a proprietary secret phero blend.

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  • 1 year later...

 

And yep, I have a pile of products right now with "secret" ingredients, including some I recently got in a trade because I hadn't really thought this whole thing through carefully. I have only recently come to realize that when other companies talk of secret molecules, they are probably researching hormones. It is unethical in my book and I will never do business with them again, or purchase a proprietary secret phero blend.

 

I'm hesitant with "secret" blends as well. I've used them, even recently, but am starting to question what I can't find in an ingredients label.

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Oxytocin is the only one that I know about Synergist. In this case, from what I have heard, it is unlikely to be successfully used in a spray form because it is not very volatile, and I have read several sources say that one would have to spray a huge amount up someone's nose to dose them with it. In any case, oxyocin is absolutely NOT a pheromone, and it can have very profound effects (it induces labor in pregnant women for example), so I would not consider it ethical to use it at all under any circumstances.

 

Beccah, pregenolone is produced in pregnant women, and everyone else as well. It is a precursor to the production of numerous other hormones (NOT just the sex hormones) that are needed in a normal healthy adult, as well as being a hormone itself. Hormones control everything in the body, not just sexual attraction. Hormones control your blood sugar, the functioning of your kidneys, the oxygen levels in your blood, etc. every minute of every day. And hormones work in such a way that very tiny amounts of them have profound affects on one's body. Anyone who has ever had a medical problem involving hormones being out of what knows this -- diabetics, hypothyroidism, hyperthyroidism, adrenal issues, etc. Just look at the list of symptoms associated, for example, with hypo- or hyperthyroidism. The list goes on and on. Most hormones have not one but many complex functions. They affect other hormones, which in turn affect other hormones. It is mind boggling and complicated. They are not something to mess around with outside a doctor's care.

 

It is all pretty scary. I personally will never buy another phero product that doesn't list all the ingredients as clearly being pheromones.

 

And yep, I have a pile of products right now with "secret" ingredients, including some I recently got in a trade because I hadn't really thought this whole thing through carefully. I have only recently come to realize that when other companies talk of secret molecules, they are probably researching hormones. It is unethical in my book and I will never do business with them again, or purchase a proprietary secret phero blend.

Agreed Xev. I want to know what I am working with where pheros are concerned. And yes, can be pretty scary!

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  • 6 months later...

um, so bottom line i'm scared of using products with pregnolone... will it affect the level of hormones in your body even just by smelling it and not ingesting it? i.e estrogen since it's a hormone precursor (dont want to screw that up - cancer risk

Edited by Wintercherry7
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