Dry down time for scented copulin blends

[CosmoTea]

Hi,

I have looked through many threads and pages of newbie questions, reviews etc. but can’t seem to find a straightforward answer. 
I have trial size fragrances enhanced with Gotcha,  Sexology and Cuddle Bunny. I also plan to order one or two of OCCOs to layer with Perfect Match. 
I get that UNscented cops need 20-30 min dry down time, but do phero-enhanced scents with cops, such as above, and OCCOs need the same dry down time?

I have my young son with me most of the time until partner gets home from work, so no spare 20 min to wait undressed for the cops to meld with the skin. 
Our long-term relationship needs a serious boost of sexy time after having a child, so I do want to try copulins. I just want to find the quickest-drying way to use them.

[oceanjewel]

Those with higher cops levels, like the OCCOs, LFN, Sexology, and Sexpionage do. Those with a small amount, like Gotcha, not so much.

[greenappletart]

I've found that if you smoosh and spread them around a bit when applying, they dry a little faster. Not hard rubbing, but just getting them into as thin a layer as possible. For me, this knocks the drying time down to no more than 15 minutes, even for heavy cops.

 

Throwing out some ideas: You might also try throwing on clothes just for the dry down time that leave the areas exposed. For example, if you're swiping them on your abdomen, maybe a sports bra or crop top with low slung pajama bottoms. Perhaps a skirt if you're using them on your inner thigh area. Or maybe a shirt that you don't wear anymore that can be your 'putting on cops' shirt that you only wear while they dry down. Like if you were going to paint a room. 

[luna65]

You should allow at least 10 minutes drydown for OCCOs and pheromone-enhanced fragrances with cops.  

[CosmoTea]

Thank you all for clarifying this for me. Does Cuddle Bunny have high cops level?

 

Those are really good ideas @greenappletart, I can walk around doing housework or dealing with my toddler in a cropped top and low sitting bottoms. For some reason, I thought drying down time meant sitting and waiting for the oil to dry🙈

[greenappletart]

The dry down is sort of like lotion sinking in. How it kind of absorbs and merges with your skin. A good metaphor might be waiting for wet nail polish to dry. You can do stuff, but you kind of have to be careful. The area of your body where you apply it is like the wet nail, only instead of leaving streaks of color if it touches something, it leaves the stink of cops. Just like you don't want to get nail polish all over a shirt (or your face) and wear it out, you don't want to get cops on it, either. I do all kinds of things, though, while waiting for the cops to dry. Apply makeup, eat, put away dishes, etc.

[Eve]

@CosmoTea I’ve not used scented Cuddle Bunny, but I wear the UN version regularly and can smell the cops in it. I don’t know if the level is quite as high as an OCCO though. I agree with @greenappletart comparison to nail polish.  It’s a good analogy.  

[CosmoTea]

Oh, I like that nail polish comparison, thanks!

So yesterday I did my hair and some housework for about 20 mins to give Cuddle Bunny enhanced w/Cuddle Bunny to meld with my skin. I find it hard to judge how many swipes from the trial vial I need because the pheromones are 1/3 of the strength. I did 4 swipes: 2 in my cleavage and 2 in a lollipop on my stomach.

This is the second time I’m using this blend around my partner (although the first time I put CB in all the wrong places, forgetting there were copulins in the blend, so any adverse reaction from him could be down to that). 
I had no cuddles from him, no interest at all. About 6 hours later I applied Unisexy w/Perfect Match (3 swipes from the trial vial on my neck and behind my ears). He did NOT want to be affectionate, despite my advances and suggestion we spend the evening together (he chose to visit a friend). My behaviour was congruent with the intended purpose of the pheros. His reactions were just not right🤔

He has had stress at work so I understand pheros can’t force him to kiss me or take me to bed if he is thinking about work or feeling tired and not in the mood for sex. But I’ve read so many positive stories about pheromones improving people’s mood and increasing desire, I’m a bit disheartened. Our relationship needs a massive boost of touchy-feeliness and intimacy on all levels. Should I try out Honeyed LP enhanced w/Gotcha and abandon CB and PM? Or should I change my dose of them? 
 

I need to decide soon what full bottles I’m ordering when Pherotine starts, and right now I’m unsure. I will order Treasured Hearts and Levitation to wear around my partner to improve his mood, but I don’t have them just now.

[CosmoTea]

Do you know what I’ve just realised! On both occasions of me wearing CB, my partner was angry and short-tempered. Could that be increased testosterone talking?? As opposed to making him full of desire, he gets full of bad mood🤭 And if that’s the case, does that mean I can’t use cops around him at all?

[citrine]

1 hour ago, CosmoTea said:

Do you know what I’ve just realised! On both occasions of me wearing CB, my partner was angry and short-tempered. Could that be increased testosterone talking?? As opposed to making him full of desire, he gets full of bad mood🤭 And if that’s the case, does that mean I can’t use cops around him at all?

 

I think this could be because of EST, not cops.

 

 

On 1/30/2022 at 9:58 AM, CosmoTea said:

dealing with my toddler

 

I wear pheromones around my kids now that they are teenagers, but I didn't when they were younger... Check out this threads. I think there could be more threads. But to each their own...

 

 

https://lovepotion.invisionzone.com/topic/6994-children-pheros/#comment-194260

 

 

[oceanjewel]

1 hour ago, CosmoTea said:

Do you know what I’ve just realised! On both occasions of me wearing CB, my partner was angry and short-tempered. Could that be increased testosterone talking?? As opposed to making him full of desire, he gets full of bad mood🤭 And if that’s the case, does that mean I can’t use cops around him at all?

He could be one of those who doesn't respond well to EST. There's a few posts around here discussing that.

Dolly's last post in this thread briefly mentions that.

[citrine]

1 hour ago, CosmoTea said:

Do you know what I’ve just realised! On both occasions of me wearing CB, my partner was angry and short-tempered. Could that be increased testosterone talking?? As opposed to making him full of desire, he gets full of bad mood🤭 And if that’s the case, does that mean I can’t use cops around him at all?

 

https://lovepotion.invisionzone.com/topic/3772-any-other-negative-male-reactions-to-est/#comment-86971

 

 

https://lovepotion.invisionzone.com/topic/8849-est-responders/#comment-317445

 

https://lovepotion.invisionzone.com/topic/10265-est-sensitive-men/#comment-392591

[CosmoTea]

This is so helpful, thank you for pointing me in the right direction! It has been a very big lesson for me. 
Now I’ve got a further question- all sexual blends contain Est (Gotcha, Blatant Invitation, Sexology- I’ve 2 out of 3 in test vials). They have other ingredients though that CB doesn’t have, so should they be ok on my partner? Like other people commented in those Est threads, my partner becomes disinterested in me, snappy and irritated when I use CB, and I don’t want to keep putting blends with Est on me unless they tend to have a less pronounced amount of Est in them.

 

Re using pheromones around kids @citrine, I have read about it and spoke with Mara. She explained that using pheros in the evening, closer to my LO’s bedtime and then washing them off in the morning should expose my LO to minimal pheromone effects. Bonding isn’t an issue at his age, and I always open a window every other hour. I believe that people use far more harmful stuff around kids, eg. Phthalates in toys, cleaning sprays, airfresheners, deodorants etc. I limit that exposure by screening the type of plastic toys we get LO are made of, not using sprays around him etc. Just my stance on it, I appreciate you have a different view.

[citrine]

22 minutes ago, CosmoTea said:

They have other ingredients though that CB doesn’t have, so should they be ok on my partner?

 

I think so, especially if EST is lower doses. But someone more experienced will probably answer that.

 

I realized I didn't say Welcome to the forum!

[CosmoTea]

52 minutes ago, citrine said:

 

I think so, especially if EST is lower doses. But someone more experienced will probably answer that.

 

I realized I didn't say Welcome to the forum!

Thank you😊 I can see how so many people get addicted to Love Potion fragrances, my list is growing by the day!

[luna65]

Right...as others have noted, your guy is probably EST-adverse.

[CosmoTea]

2 hours ago, luna65 said:

Right...as others have noted, your guy is probably EST-adverse.

Yeah, seems that way. In your experience, do LFM, Blatant Invitation and Gotcha have less Est in them or something else that counteracts the effects of Est? I’m still learning about the science of it all. 
OCCOs will be safe as they don’t have Est in them, right?

[luna65]

Right.

 

I wouldn't use Gotcha! or LFM because the EST is specific to the effects of the blend.  BI is more aggressively sexual so that might be more successful in a particular context.  But the thing is it's all about balancing the ingredients for a unified effect more than something counteracting something else.  That's actually counter-intuitive to an outcome.

[Eve]

OCCOS are just the fragrance and couplins.  You can have other fragrances boosted with cops though. Recent new releases have many choices that are pheromone free too.  Or, you could get something like UN Magnet that just has alpha-androstenol and cops in it, and have her boost a fragrance that has no extras with  that (or another of your choosing, just giving an example).  
 

Quite recently I’ve ordered Beewitched with OCCO strength cops, and two other bottles boosted with different pheromone blends. Also, I got Weenie Roast that already contains alpha-androstenol  in it with an OCCO strength addition of cops.  
 

And, if you have Mara do the adding (especially with pheromones) you’ll know it’s done in balance with the fragrance being used.  

Edited January 31, 2022 by Eve

[CosmoTea]

I get what you mean @luna65, counteract wasn’t the right word for what I was looking for. I’ll try BI. I have a test vial of Sexology, is that also a no-go or is it similar in terms of balanced ingredients to BI?

 

Thanks @Eve, I was actually thinking about getting an UN bottle of something and having light fragrance added to it, as opposed to boosting a fragrance bottle with pheros. It works out as the same strength of pheros (1000mg) but cheaper (I have to factor in international shipping costs). I haven’t seen anyone mention that option much. Is that not a popular option?

 

Ah, I have no idea now what full bottle to get, seeing that I’ve got half my order of test vials that I can’t use now because of the Est effect. Don’t want to end up with full bottles going to waste. 

I’m wondering if I should just get a bottle of OCCOs and add it to...Treasured Hearts? Levitation? Neither of which I’ve ordered yet, so don’t know if the balance of Est with other ingredients is going to soothe or aggravate my partner. Do you ladies think I’m better off contacting Mara directly with all my questions? Don’t want to clog up the forum with my dilemma.

[citrine]

32 minutes ago, CosmoTea said:

Ah, I have no idea now what full bottle to get, seeing that I’ve got half my order of test vials that I can’t use now because of the Est effect. Don’t want to end up with full bottles going to waste. 

 

This month is Pherotine (if I'm not mistaking). Which means all new releases will be phero'd plus we have a chance to buy UNs in smaller vials. So you'll maybe have a better chance to try out pheros before getting a FB.

39 minutes ago, CosmoTea said:

I’m wondering if I should just get a bottle of OCCOs and add it to...Treasured Hearts? Levitation?

 

You can just layer it, you don't have to add it to something. That's at least how I like it.

 

40 minutes ago, CosmoTea said:

Do you ladies think I’m better off contacting Mara directly with all my questions? Don’t want to clog up the forum with my dilemma.

 

Feel free to post here. The more topics we have, the more we can all learn IMO. That's why I love this forum.

 

[CosmoTea]

Ah, that’s a good idea, trying out the vials first. That’s what I had in mind, layering them (still learning the lingo😊). 
I’ve emailed Mara for advice on the blends with Est and combinations I could try when Pherotine starts. 
 

[luna65]

6 hours ago, CosmoTea said:

I get what you mean @luna65, counteract wasn’t the right word for what I was looking for. I’ll try BI. I have a test vial of Sexology, is that also a no-go or is it similar in terms of balanced ingredients to BI?

 

Sexology is similar in effect to BI so I think it would be okay to experiment with for your purposes.

 

And yes - that's what this forum is for, so it's okay to ask questions!

[Eve]

@CosmoTea The main reason I choose to have certain fragrances boosted with various pheros is because I like that fragrance a lot, and want to have the versatility of wearing the same scent with different intentions.   As for ones I have boosted with cops, they are usually ones that I don’t have an OCCO on hand that I feel would work as well with notes in that perfume.  Honestly, I feel like OCCO White goes with almost everything,  I don’t even know how many bottles I’ve gone through at this point.  
 

I also have a bottle of Essence of Woman, but I chicken out most of the time before I try mixing it with a perfume I like.  I trust Mara to know how much that particular scent can handle before it can no longer mask the smell of EOW.  
 

Keep in mind that I’m quite a bit older than you are, post menopausal, and can get away with wearing a heavier amount of cops. 
 

When I first joined the forum, I did a good bit of reading, and I came across those threads on EST averse men.  I was so reluctant to try a blend or perfume that was EST forward for the longest time  because I didn’t know how he woulda react.  As it turns out EST isn’t a problem with him, and wear UN Cuddle Bunny for his benefit quite a lot.  You just don’t know until you try it.
 

 This was so far off of my radar when you began this post, that I never even thought of it until  @citrine and @oceanjewelmentioned it.  (Good call!)

 

Oh wow, I just noticed where you live.   It’s gorgeous there!  I love the architecture, and (of course)the coastline.   

Edited February 1, 2022 by Eve

[CosmoTea]

Thanks @luna65, it really helps to learn from more experienced users. 
 

@EveI’ve read other people praising OCCO White scent too. 
Thank you😊 Aside from being windy and having four seasons in a day, it’s got its moments😊

 

I’ve exchanged emails with Mara and thought I’d share her interesting thoughts with you ladies, because it has certainly given me a lot of food for thought and maybe it’ll help someone reading this thread in the future. She reckons the cops and the musky, sexy fragrance scent could be putting my partner off, or he might be associating Est with pregnancy which neither of us wants right now.

He was caring and very involved during my pregnancy, when he was exposed to a lot of Est. He could have subconsciously put me into a Mother category rather than a Sexy Lady category, so the cops could be making him feel uneasy. 
He could also prefer fresh, clean scents (which to me phero-enhanced Cuddle Bunny was) rather than heavy seductive ones. We decided to wait for the Pherotine releases and then Mara will brainstorm with me further (so kind of her!!). Some other brands don’t even reveal what their phero blends contain!
 

I remembered about a small vial of BAM with a Pink Amber cover scent. Now, that could be an interesting experiment- since it has no Est at all and has cops in common with CB, I could give 3-4 swipes a go and test my partner’s reaction!!😃 Then I will know whether Est is the problem or the cops (or both🤭). What do you ladies think?

I just need to decide if I am ready for a potential bout of snappy and irritable behaviour ruining our date 2.0😂

Edited February 4, 2022 by CosmoTea

[greenappletart]

@CosmoTea The BAM sounds like a good idea. For as much as there are major trends with each blend, there are also a lot of individual reactions. The best thing is always to experiment. Other people's experiences can give you an idea of what to expect, but you never know until you try. Each person and situation is unique. If you can narrow things down, it will help you find what works best for you. That's one of the reasons I love the trial sizes of the phero enhanced scents. It really lets you try out different mixes without committing to a large bottle. (Of course, I also love virgin bottles so I can change things up. 😁 )

[raydee8_love]

On 2/1/2022 at 4:39 AM, citrine said:

This month is Pherotine (if I'm not mistaking)

I am still in debt from the summer sale..... but I can't wait for Pherotine !!

[CosmoTea]

@greenappletart You are right, I will just have to try the various things to see what works for me. I guess having had a difficult couple of years with my partner and recent fails with pheromones around him, I didn’t want to bring more negativity to our relationship by using the wrong pheromones. 
 

@raydee8_love This will be my first Pherotine so I’m double excited! Do we know when it starts?

[citrine]

11 hours ago, raydee8_love said:

I am still in debt from the summer sale..... but I can't wait for Pherotine !!

LOL me too!!!

[Eve]

@CosmoTea  I’m glad you wrote Mara. She helped me considerably when I first found LPMP.  She’s a doll.

[raydee8_love]

On 2/6/2022 at 4:01 AM, CosmoTea said:

Do we know when it starts?

no - but it's usually in February ... i think

 

might be late b/c  of c19

[CosmoTea]

Ladies, I’ve got a new question about cops, while we are all waiting for the Pherotine to start. How do cops manage to affect men if we use the Lollipop Method, i.e. keeping cops on our chest and tummy under clothes? I get some of the scent evaporates from the cleavage upwards, but unless I was to move my chest really close to my SO’s face (a bit creepy during normal conversations, meals etc.😂), and unless I waved my wrists around him, how could cops reach him? I get if we were in our underwear, the scent would be accessible, but at the moment I need to actually put us in the mood for undressing first.

[Vika]

For me with cops, I don’t do the lollipop method because I found it to be too much.

Ive had people act really goofy, put their arms around me, tell me I smell good (women too) however, women can get bitchy when you’re wearing cops. 

I just put a small amount in between the girls and that’s it. Trust me he will smell them regardless of the scent being there or not. You’ll notice when he looks at you differently or gets aggressive in a good way.

Ive had people sniff the air at my desk with a small amount on. And they last at least 24 hrs after a shower too so If you plan on going somewhere you’ll get reactions. lmao

I need to start wearing mine again too, it’s been awhile. lol

The last time I was asked out on a date I was wearing LFN which is loaded with cops.

My best advice would be to just be yourself and see what happens, don’t feel bad if he doesn’t react because you’ll still selfies and feel sexy on your own with cops. 

[Eve]

@CosmoTea I don’t use lollipop method that much. (BTW  I am older and use more cops than some on the forum). I prefer rolling it down my sides starting right below where any deodorant is applied.  Then I smoosh my inner arms up against my sides to help spread it a bit, and add some in the crooks of my elbows, back of knees, or similar warm places.  
 

If I don’t expect intimacy to occur soon (he’s even older than me)  I will put a touch in cleavage.  I used to do this every day because It is the perfect spot for the scent emanating upward, but he has mentioned that he doesn’t like getting perfume taste in his mouth (who does, right?) and because of this I usually steer clear of the girls if I have plans 😀 

 

For self effects I have added some where I can smell it.  Literally under my nostrils.  Or Blatant Invitation  there.  Tiny enough amount so that I don’t worry I am propelling anything funky smelling when I exhale. This has a fairly immediate effect for me.  
 

Don’t forget that if you’ve given birth in the last few years that it can effect your hormone levels for quite some time, and that can have a huge impact on libido.  Your partner can also have conflicts in this area, not so much hormonal, but feeling it’s okay to have these feelings for the mother of his child.  It’s possible he needs to adjust to you playing two roles, one as a seductress, the other as the one who nurtures and cares for his child. Just something to think about. 

 

 

[greenappletart]

I tend to think of it sort of like a wax warmer. (I know I use a lot of analogies, but that's because I tend to think in analogies.) How the heat of your body makes it diffuse throughout the air.  The clothes may trap some of it in, but they will also make that body part warmer, creating more diffusion. Also, most clothing fabric is gong to breathe some. Think of the difference between wearing a regular fabric jacket and one of those rain jackets that is pure plastic. The plastic traps everything (heat, sweat, etc) and can quickly become uncomfortable, but the fabric jacket doesn't. At least, not to the same degree. So, as long as you aren't dressed in pvc, some of the cops and pheros will be getting through. Though I guess more layers would probably cause more loss. 

[CosmoTea]

@greenappletart Oops, thought I’d replied! I love analogies, they are really helpful to illustrate a point. 

@Eve I used BAM, got no obvious reaction from him. Still talked about work, LO, house chores etc., as usual. But he wasn’t in a bad mood🙏 Then tried Gotcha another day, and again, no obvious reaction, but no bad mood either. Still waiting for an obvious hit though👀

 

New dilemma ladies:

Instead of starting a new topic, thought I would post my new dilemma here, since we have discussed sensitivities to things here.

I got a trial size of Flying Potion with Levitation and thought, this would surely be a winner when worn around my partner. Would put him in a great mood etc. 

 

Well… He was definitely NOT in a great mood after hanging out with me close enough to smell me. The scent is definitely not the reason for it, it’s a lovely floral scent the type that I would normally wear. I wore it the whole day, and he was moody and irritable the whole day about the little things out of nowhere. We did kiss, but then he was irritable again. As if he got close to me long enough to get hit by whatever is in Levitation and got affected by it.
 

I combed through the ingredients, and there is no Est in Levitation, so the theory about him being Est-sensitive couldn’t explain his behaviour. I also know he gets along well with Alpha- and Beta-Androstenol because I used a product containing those two from another brand in the past and he was in a very happy, talkative mood every time. 

We are left with Epi-Androsterone and DHEAS (which I discovered is short for Dehydroepiandrosterone so a derivative of Epi-Arone). These same two are also in Perfect Match which my partner had a bad reaction to (that very moody episode on our date night🙄). So I wonder, is there such a thing as sensitivity to these ingredients??
 

Most social/bonding blends contain Epi-Arone, so that could rule out Treasured Hearts etc. for me too.. I’m desperate to bond and enhance our good times with my SO, rather than cause the opposite. We get along just fine right until I use certain pheromones. My behaviour is congruent with the blends’ intent and I apply them in all the right places (2-3 swipes with a trial vial stick between wrists and crooks of elbows, one behind each ear, sometimes along the hairline on my neck). 

[citrine]

3 hours ago, CosmoTea said:

(2-3 swipes with a trial vial stick between wrists and crooks of elbows, one behind each ear, sometimes along the hairline on my neck). 

 

Have you tried applying more? Or do you get the same result? 

 

Have you tried BI?

[Vika]

I’m not sure if this will work for you but have you tried using Balm Bomb yet? I’m not sure if it has epi-Arone in it but I have gotten attention and affection while wearing it because it has TH-Doc in it.

Also, cougar potion is a good  one in general which has cops in it already like Gotcha but it’s more on the sexy side. Another one I would suggest would be TMI to get him to open up to you but apply it to the back of your neck and shoulders maybe because it can make you talk a lot as well.
With the trial vials, try pouring some product out onto your finger instead of the wand, sometimes the wand doesn’t get enough product out.

Edit**I forgot to add if Levitation is too much for him which it can be it has caused me to be jittery or shakey before, try open windows on its own. 

The more womanly blends La Femme Mystere and La femme Noire have that feminine mystique vibe but also respectful. They both contain EST though. 
 

Edited March 13, 2022 by Vika
Missed a word

[Eve]

@CosmoTea I am so not the person to advise on pheromones!  Really.  
 

After that disclaimer, I will say that with the  trial vials, to get a clearer idea of reactions either to the pheromone or even the fragrance, it’s best to just upend the vial on your skin (don’t lift it up!) and apply that way.  The little wand that comes in the trial vials delivers such a tiny amount.  
 

I remember taking notes about TH-Doc, back when I first discovered LPMP.  Unfortunately I decided it was a great idea to enter the notes on my iPhone for easy reference.  I subsequently decided it was an even better idea to password those notes, so my guy wouldn’t accidentally see them (he still has no idea I use cops or pheromones heh heh).  The failure was that I didn’t keep referring to what I wrote, and as time passed I completely forgot what password I used (or what I wrote)  and I cannot access them myself. Ah well…

Part of me wonders if your partner isn’t subconsciously sensing how hard you are trying to get him to reestablish that bond and commitment you previously had, and it’s not so much a pheromone he is reacting poorly to, as much as it is not wanting to be forced into something he is not ready for.  How would  you feel if you were preparing to go somewhere with him, and you truly wanted to go, but you weren’t ready yet.  You were still putting the finishing touches getting ready. Meanwhile he’s out in the car, and keeps honking the horn to remind you he’s wants to go right then, that very moment, not later when you were comfortable that you could go and have a good time.   
 

It might not be the pheromone at all, just that he could feel manipulated but can’t identify why he’s feeling that way. I don’t know if I’m making sense, or if I’m completely off base.  But, if this was the case, then it would be like you saying it’s all about you and what you want.  You know, “Get close to me Honey, I smell happy today (Levitation) I’m a fun person to be around.  See how happy you feel when you’re with me?”  
 

Cops would be excluded from inadvertently causing this reaction, because straight men pretty much have to react well to copulins.  And, a sexual connection does lead to emotional bonds that lead to commitment, cops should not have anything but a positive outcome for you. 
 

Or, it could be that with a trial vial of unscented pheromone, you’re just not using enough.

Or, like you said, it could be this particular molecule combination. That’s a @luna65 and @Potion Master question perhaps. 

 

Edited March 13, 2022 by Eve

[Vika]

I was thinking the same thing to be honest. Sometimes when you’ve known someone for so long and they’re familiar with everything you do and then you go and change how you act or your personality (this being the pheromone signature), it can be a major change that the other person has to get used to.

 I had one relationship where I wore pheros constantly because that’s how the person got to know me off the bat and I do not recommend this as you’re hiding your true chemistry. Now if I’m comfortable or know the person well enough before dating, I tell them “hey I  sometimes use pheros” and I haven’t gotten a bad reaction from that statement yet.

Does he know about this though? If you talk to him about it, you could maybe get him more engaged in spicing things up or even get fragrances for him. And there are non phero scents for men that I personally really love which are Merlin’s Blend and Conjurer. Mara works magic with and without pheros so I would also suggest regular Love Potion blends too as they definitely work on their own (original, black for sure, pink etc.)